S02E02 - The C17 Power Couple

Dave Rogers: 0:43

Okay, shall we? Shall we make a podcast?

Emily Barkemayer: 0:46

Let's do it.

Dave Rogers: 0:47

Thanks for your time, guys. Let's do it. Jared. Emily, welcome to pilot base. I am currently in very, very rainy. Well, I was gonna say London but it's not London. It's Bristol, but I don't expect you British geography to be too well. Emily, where in the world do you

Emily Barkemayer: 1:06

how we are in Lanai Hawaii. So one of the smaller islands out here in Hawaii on vacation actually. So happy to be here.

Dave Rogers: 1:16

Ben, How good does that sound a vacation in Hawaii? We're not allowed to leave the country at the moment. So one day Have you been been to Hawaii?

Ben Hall: 1:27

I've never been right, the top of my bucket list.

Dave Rogers: 1:31

One day one day, Jared. So you're on vacation in Hawaii? Where do you guys normally reside?

Jared Barkemayer: 1:38

We normally reside on Oahu, so it's just another island over. But things are opening up a little more. So it's just easy to hop over a 30 minute flight took a PC 12 yesterday, it was a pretty awesome experience just to hop over the island. And now we got a couple days here. My mom flew in town to watch our oldest or only son right now and we're on a baby moon because we're expecting our second baby boy in a couple months. So that's our last vacation.

Dave Rogers: 2:08

I've never heard of a babymoon before but I'm fully on board with it. excuse to get away together. So Emily, are you currently flying even though you're pregnant? What are the implications there?

Unknown: 2:22

I am not flying right now. So I could I flew all the way up to my 28 week mark. And then in the airforce, they might get stopped. So I flew from 12 to 28 weeks and now I'm on the ground until I give birth and then come back from maternity leave. Amazing and Jared Are you well obviously you're on the baby moon at the moment. But

Dave Rogers: 2:42

are you currently in the air?

Unknown: 2:44

Yeah, definitely. still flying. I just got back from a trip last week doing some training in in the continental United States for Nevada, Washington State and then we went up to Alaska to do some training with some of our army units. They're amazing.

Dave Rogers: 3:00

Right so most of the people who listen to this podcast are going to be familiar with you guys because of your unreal social media followings Vishal get on to in a bit. But for those who are a pilot based podcast fans who are meeting new guys for the first time, um, can you give us a bit of background in your and your sort of piloting stories and journeys, ladies first family? Let's go with you.

Emily Barkemayer: 3:23

Sure, sure. So Jared, and I have very similar journey. But we both went to the Air Force Academy, class of 2012, in Colorado Springs, Colorado. From there, we went to pilot training. Jared was in a class a month ahead of me. So he was unfortunately seven and I was 1408. We, we both dropped t ones, which is what we wanted. And from there, we knew we wanted to fly c seven teams. And so and let me see April 2014. No, yeah, April 2014 is when we graduated pilot training. And our C 17. journey began. And we've been flying those ever since.

Dave Rogers: 4:01

So so you literally kind of came through at the same time. Jared, you you were a little bit ahead. But since then, the journey has been side by side.

Jared Barkemayer: 4:10

Yeah, we've every pilot, I guess. beginnings are different. But ours were pretty tied at the hip from the from the beginning we've been we've known each other since we're just talking about it last night at dinner. Since 2009. dated most of that time, I think only like a year or two we were not. And then ever since we've been kind of paired at the hip for training and flying. we've deployed together like it's been a it's been a pretty fortunate experience. We've worked hard for it so and say lucky. But we're fortunate that the stars have aligned we've been doing the same thing together this whole time

Dave Rogers: 4:45

sitting I believe in luck, but you've got to be in the position to take advantage of it when it comes to I mean you are lucky because as you said the stars had aligned how difficult would it have been if one of you hadn't have qualified that would have been awful?

Emily Barkemayer: 4:58

Oh, yeah, I can't we've we've seen it happen. Couples drop different airframes or like in completely different types of aircraft. And it's it's an uphill battle from the very beginning. So we think our lucky stars that that we didn't have to face that for sure.

Jared Barkemayer: 5:14

This is no good. We are sorry. We made a conscious decision to pick a airframe that had a more crew aircraft. It wasn't a fighter track or anything, let's single seaters that had less availability. So we made a conscious decision that was a priority obviously to stay together. And as well as I mean it was our number one choice even without that we're like this. This seems like it fits everything that we want to do and in our careers and it has in spades, so.

Dave Rogers: 5:40

So what was it about this the c 17? You said you fly, right? What is it about that plane that sort of made it so special that you guys wanted to commit to it?

Jared Barkemayer: 5:49

I'll take this one I said, I think in I'm hoping not speaking for too much. But we do enjoy travelling. I mean, we're on vacation right now. And when I so that the mobility aircraft that the the airframe nc 17 is we travel around the world, I mean, we've been over 40 countries. We haven't travelled too many recently, obviously, to the current state of things. But in our first you know, three or four years, we've done 30 countries, some of those are just airports, but we do enjoy travelling, and then the whole aspect of it being such a multi capable airframe, it does aerial feeling we do we have the airdrop mission that's talking about so it's not and then we can do you know, short field takeoff and landings into dirt. Pardon me. So there's just a lot of things about it. And then the base is where your base I know, I've been talking about but even this, it's very similar. You want to you want to live in locations where that plane is and not have to commute or live in a undesirable location. So are the basis for the C 17. We're all pretty good for as far as continental United States, we ended up in Hawaii, obviously. So

Dave Rogers: 7:01

any job that takes you to Hawaii, I'm trying to think what the what, what would the British comparison be been like Anglesey? Or something like that? Oakland islands? Oh, goodness. So neither of you are from Hawaii? indigenously, are you?

Emily Barkemayer: 7:17

No, no, no, I'm from a landlocked state. So as Jared, so we're happy to be here.

Dave Rogers: 7:22

I can imagine unreal. So they've been to 40 countries. Ben, how many countries is worth taking you to do you know, off the top your head?

Ben Hall: 7:31

I'm probably a similar amount. But actually, probably for me, I've just visited more airports because especially when i when i was short all I was just diving in and out of dodgy airports in the Middle East. So yeah, I didn't get a slaver. Let

Dave Rogers: 7:48

me get out as quickly as you can any. Any particularly obscure countries that any of you have been to, that you'd like to share stories from?

Jared Barkemayer: 8:01

I haven't been to actually, I'm gonna sound bad. I don't actually know who owns Ascension Island, I think the British do I want to say

Dave Rogers: 8:09

so I want to say France, France, okay,

Jared Barkemayer: 8:13

so. But between South America and Africa, and in a lot of pilot training, I don't know if you can speak to this, but they show you know, some optical illusions of airfields and how they look like. So essentially, this runway is on like a very large drop off of a cliff and the first 3000 feet of the runway are like a straight uphill. And then the back half, it looks like a ski lodge jump, you know, like, so a lot of training manuals have the approach into there. But that was kind of very obscure place that a lot of people can kind of put the the pin on the map. I don't know, if you have one of those maps been where you like put try to keep track of it all, or an app. But that was one of the coolest places I've been personally,

Emily Barkemayer: 8:57

I got I got to do go to Pisco, Peru a couple times for a summit that was happening down there. And it was very cool. And we don't get to go to South America too often. So that was that was a lot of fun.

Ben Hall: 9:11

When you have little deployments in sort of nicer places. what's what's your schedule, like? Do you actually get to explore the place much? Or are you kind of stuck on a base somewhere?

Emily Barkemayer: 9:21

It just depends. Like for that one, there was no base. And so we got to go out in town. And we ended up being there for like four or five days at a resort and so we got to go travel around and and it was the it was really fun. Now sometimes there's places like you know, we'll land in Greece, and we'll only get to stay there for 24 hours, and then we're out. So it just and of course those times you push it up and try to make the most of it. But it all just depends on the mission and what else is going on down the line.

Dave Rogers: 9:50

I've just You were right. I don't know why a question to charge. You were right. It's got a bunion flag on the on the essential. I think I got it confused with Reunion Island, which is in a completely different part of planet Earth. So never ever question the global geography of 71 actually flies around the world. I told you I'd ask some silly questions. So So Jared, your urine demo team pilot, is that correct? Yes, that means for somebody to see 70

Jared Barkemayer: 10:23

for that pack, f c 17 demonstration team, there's a few c 17 demo teams in the United States Air Force. It just means that we do a lot of outreach events and specifically since we're, I want to say pack Afro Pacific Air Forces are in the US indo Pay comm Peter, it's a lot of acronyms but our fancy words, but all that means is we try to fly around the Pacific and do outreach events and in our partner allied countries, so some of the big ones are South Korea, Japan, or Australia or New Zealand. And we do air shows there for recruitment as well as to these are the first time some people have met Americans, and obviously just put a good foot forward. And I let them know, we're all you know, good allies and partners. And then they ask some, so you say you ask them the questions. I've heard many silly questions that these did air air events in South Korea, they're very happy to talk to us, but they just asked some off the wall things you'd never expect.

Dave Rogers: 11:20

But I need to know more.

Jared Barkemayer: 11:22

Oh, yeah, I got to think of something I knew there was a lead on question on like, what have they been saying. But to finish the question out, we do several, either addition to conventional orders called trade shows. So the big one we're doing this fall is the sole 8x, which is a trade show. I don't know if you've seen Iron Man, but kind of think of like the beginning where they're either they're selling weapons or they're buying weapons, or they're just buying planes or selling planes. It's like that. And then we obviously do an air show on the back half so and then we have like three or four of those shows. And then some of them are just traditional air shows where it's more of a recruitment tool as well as just an outreach event. So like I said, first time people are meeting Americans

Ben Hall: 12:08

you guys kind of doing aerobatics and formation flying and stuff like that? Or is it more what you checking out the back of the aircraft?

Jared Barkemayer: 12:15

Both so the main profile is a 12 minute profile, kind of almost like a capabilities demonstration to show we do some high speed flight. With some manoeuvring nothing substantial like bank, we only do 45 degree bank turns but we do, you know, slow flight. So we'll be fully configured at probably about 115 knots fully configure doing a slow flight over the airfield at 45 degree bank turns just to show them the manoeuvrability. And then the biggest thing that we do is we do a landing a short field landing essentially. And we go straight into an immediate backing on the runway. So it's called the rubberband manoeuvre, because we have, we have loadmasters in a part of the demonstration team, and they'll open the back door up and then they'll guide us back. So lands you know, stop within 2000 feet, and then immediately start backing, you know, to around 10 knots, and that's the big crowd favourite, it is tough to go out, we usually follow an F 16 demo team or the black angels out of South Korea, we follow them or sometimes Thunderbirds are the I know you've talked to Blue Angels pilot and after we fly after them or an eye 16 demo team, it's kind of tough to wow the crowd with a big plane. It does capture your eye just because it's such a large aircraft. But once we land and start backing that is probably the crowd favourite when we're waving and backings and

Ben Hall: 13:35

flies a large aircraft, I cannot imagine a stopping in that amount of distance and then be reversing down the runway. work so it's pretty cool to popper in reverse and just get off back lakemaster that's just kind of telling you a bit more left a bit more right.

Jared Barkemayer: 13:52

Yeah, coordinated dance, essentially, they're like they're guiding their speed to make sure. And then using the correct terms, and then if we stop hearing them count where and stop talking because we just assume that we hopefully they didn't fall out. But that never happened. That is something we briefed you contingency wise. So it is a really cool point.

Dave Rogers: 14:11

So whenever we speak to guys like you who do amazing things in planes, my immediate question to Ben is, how does that make you feel better? And the answer is invariably nervous. Does that make you feel better?

Ben Hall: 14:29

in commercial in the commercial world, we're just like, surrounded by this bubble of safety and then like extra buffers just to make sure. So like, I mean, just taxing a 380 around an airfield is is hard enough, let alone doing it backwards.

Emily Barkemayer: 14:46

Yeah, exactly. Yeah, we've drawn some 90 degree turns or some star turns on a 50 foot taxiway and it gets real sporty. So

Dave Rogers: 14:56

sporty. And amateur you you don't demo fly, do but am I correct in thinking you're an instructor?

Emily Barkemayer: 15:04

That's correct. Yep. I'm not on the demo team. We had to make a decision on who was going to take that one and Jared took that for us. So but yeah, I'm an instructor and so as Jared Okay,

Dave Rogers: 15:16

so how do you take like a package you

Ben Hall: 15:17

basically offer your services together to the airforce? two options for everything.

Emily Barkemayer: 15:24

Yeah, well, our our qualifications are so similar that on paper we look we look very similar. Jared just upgraded to evaluator so he's got me on that one. But on paper when you see us to like okay, well which Mark Meyer wants it.

Dave Rogers: 15:40

Did you decide you said you sent out a tech that one? How did you decide? Was it like rock paper scissors? Or did you have to toss a coin?

Jared Barkemayer: 15:49

I think it was a little more civil the despite we usually do have some arguments or I guess that we settle things with Walker chance in that regard. But yeah, I think it was like, Hey, I kind of want to take this one. And she gladly stepped aside. And then with obviously, having babies and stuff, Emily, the one reason I'm a little farther in the progression of flying in the military is just due to Emily's time off having our children are first and then our second son on the way. But that's the only reason and she's obviously it's a unique experience to fly while she's doing that. And I'm very fortunate and blessed that she, she's taking that for us, because obviously I wanted a family. But it's ultimately her time out of the aircraft while she's pregnant. And out of that, you know, after giving birth with a maternity leave and stuff like that. So with that being said, I was very fortunate that she let me do it because we can't be on the team together. The current roles is like we can't fly, operate in the same aircraft at the same time we can be on the same aircraft was passengers, that's fine, but we can't be operating the aircraft at the same time. Okay.

Dave Rogers: 16:58

So do you. Is it your plan to go back into piloting Emily? Who you? Oh, 100% can't wait to get back. This is the thing, Ben like doing this. So I think I said to you before, before we started the episode, this is, since we've been doing this podcast, this has really been my first experience of getting to know pilots. And I love how much you will love being pilots and how much you will love aviation and just just everything that goes with it. And one thing I didn't ask right at the beginning, you gave us your journey into becoming pilots. But what was it about aviation? In the beginning? like the idea of becoming a pilot? What originally sparked your interest? Emily, are you from a, from an aviation family from a military family? How did you originally get the spark?

Emily Barkemayer: 17:56

I'm really not my dad was a marine. But that was way before I was born. But honestly, he would I grew up in a really small town of Colorado, and every year there's an air show in Grand Junction. And he would take me to the air show and the Blue Angels always came. This is like so corny, but I always came and, and there was some big jets there too. But like that really sparked my interest and, and then I ended up at the Academy. And it seemed like a pretty, I don't want to say easy option. But the the opportunity was definitely there. And there's actually a time where I chose not to be a pilot, because at the time, like the washout rates were really high. And as a 20 year old kid, they were telling me that, you know, if you wash out, you have to pay back your education, which is to the tune of like 350 grand. And

Dave Rogers: 18:46

so when you say wash out, does that mean not pass or leave?

Emily Barkemayer: 18:49

Right? Yeah, exactly. So feel out a pilot training, which is, I don't want to say it's common, but it's not unheard of. And so when they gave us our jobs list, I didn't put pilot and, and of course deer has never been intimidated by anything. And that didn't faze him whatsoever. But me.

Jared Barkemayer: 19:09

But one thing that's my wife. There's many things that is the primary ones who shouldn't say that.

Emily Barkemayer: 19:19

Anyway, so I put that and I immediately regretted it. But there was nothing I could do. Because I had submitted my I've made my choice. And now I have to you know, I made my bed now I have to sleep in it. And like a month later, they came back and they were like, hey, this system had a malfunction. Like you have to resubmit your jobs. And that was like, for me, I felt like it was fate. Like I was meant to be a pilot. This was God give me a second chance. And I did it and I never looked back. So that's that.

Dave Rogers: 19:44

I love that. What about you, Jared? That's a heck of a romantic story to follow.

Jared Barkemayer: 19:50

I'm less romantic. My I grew up in New Mexico. So in southern United States, and my elementary school was sorry, its primary. Sorry. Yeah, yeah. So I was kind of in a very rural area. And looking back at it, I realised it was near kind of a military base that operated some c 130 aircraft. And I guess we were like, underneath one of the training routes a low level flight and they would fly but the past our playground and I was a kid and I would just look up but that seems pretty neat. Like I think I want to do that. So it's literally just seeing the planes, you know, fly around our playground or at recess, you know, playing dodgeball or whatever seeing them and that was like a recruiting tool for me and then the first time I I wrote on a passenger aircraft on Southwest airlines 737 I remember that feeling in your stomach on takeoff I was probably eight or nine. Usually that feeling comes from like when the pilot does a more of a negative manoeuvre which airline pilots are not supposed to be doing a lot of negative G's, looking back at it. Think thanks for that pilot. I don't if you got to turbulence or something that I felt that I was like, Man, this is an interesting feeling looking out the window and seeing the mountain go by. And I was like, this seems like a good idea. I want to do that. But my family didn't have much aviation. My father was in the Navy. My brother was in the US Army. And then so they kind of steered me. But I think a lot of our why we're fortunate to the air forces, we both wanted to go to the Air Force Academy for sports. And I know that kind of lends itself to your background, Dave. So that's where we met is on the the athletics team are used track and field team. Okay. So that kind of was a recruiting tool. And that's how they kind of got us there. And we obviously stayed for different reasons, but to do sports, there was a huge benefit to all that and then we knew the benefits of aviation and the career fields afterwards. So that was a no brainer. Awesome. I

Dave Rogers: 21:43

love that. What What were your events in track and field?

Emily Barkemayer: 21:46

I was afforded hurdler and Jared was the thrower.

Dave Rogers: 21:49

Yeah, right. We'll come to thrown in a bit. But 400 hurdles is the most difficult event in track and field. Discuss. I'm not going to argue with you I think is pretty damn hard. So here's why a

Jared Barkemayer: 22:08

sprint maximum effort but we're gonna throw things for you to jump over a little bit and then she's on the Air Force Academy record for a long time to store three. But she was very good I was throwing is obviously totally different. And when I was not anywhere near the top 10 lists, I just liked lifting weights and seeing the pretty girls run box. Yeah,

Dave Rogers: 22:29

good man. Good man, man, you get on very well. So my my point with the 400 hurdles is me as a human with full functioning limbs. I could complete a 10,000 metres or 5000 metres or 100 metres and it'd be very slow. But I don't think I could complete a 400 and you're laughing there is no way you could complete 400 hurdles. The other the other one is

Ben Hall: 22:59

I'm 65 I can get over those hurdles. Dude.

Dave Rogers: 23:02

Come on. I know your knees. Yeah. The other one is pole vault. I don't think I could do a pole vault. So I would say 400 hurdles followed by pole vault are the two hardest in track and field. I mean, I I wouldn't trust me with a hammer or a javelin either. To be honest. You can still move it forward. But yeah, yeah, yeah. So some people so what point did you what point did the track and field disappear to the side and it was full steam ahead with the with the flying the planes?

Emily Barkemayer: 23:38

graduation So okay, we I was the four years for track and then at graduation, they you know, we're like, Okay, well, that was fine. Go pilot training. So what I did,

Dave Rogers: 23:51

do you know what, Ben, that it's, I mean, I know we're cycling into sports here, but you know, what hasn't? What Ben hasn't told you is that both him and his wife are Paralympians, but we'll get to that. In American sports, it seems as though the system is always sort of set up to end at one point, like you'll do it until the end of high school. And if you're not good enough, you'll never do it again, or you'll do it to the end of college. And if you're not good enough, you'll never do it again, or you'll maybe get the chance to do it professionally. And then you'll come to the end of your career and that's it. Whereas whereas in the UK we don't have the same elite high school and college setup, but there are systems in place that allow you to continue with your sports afterwards. I mean, everybody is terrible at it, but at least it's easy to do it a little bit more like into into adulthood and stuff like that.

Emily Barkemayer: 24:44

Yeah, yeah, that's we definitely like we talked about often that we miss competition now in pilot training, it's a whole different form of competition and so that kind of fed into that well enough I would say plus you're too busy to do anything else but yeah, we we definitely still like miss that form. And we seek it out in other avenues. Yeah,

Jared Barkemayer: 25:08

I tried to hold on to the athletic stream a little longer than she did after graduation. I tried out for never done this, like I said, New Mexico, you know us geography but it's a desert climate. After graduation. The Air Force has a programme called the world class athlete programme where if you're good in a significant or an Olympic event, you can compete wearing the US Air Force emblem as a recruiting tool as well. I was nowhere good enough for tracker athletic or throwing I was terrible. So however, I am Just kind of naturally athletic. So I there's tried out for the US bobsled team yesterday skeleton, because they're recruit me they're recruiting is just is a combine event. So you're running short distances and get scored on and then you throw shotput, which actually was linked to my throwing career and then some Olympic lifting weights, as well as like a standing broad jump. And those are all things that I'm just I trained towards, and I'm really good at that don't necessarily apply to like skipping well at a sport, but I can do them stagnant. So I scored really well got invited to do skeleton, bobsled trials in Lake Placid, New York. And then I got, I did fairly well to camp, I got invited back to start that journey. However, I was really, it was kind of like to, you know, the roads diverged, I either had a full head of steam with trying to be an Olympic athlete, and it's only like a two year programme outside the Olympics. And I probably wouldn't have got on even if everything went perfect. Until like the 2016 Olympics. So this was 2012 at the time, and I was, I was okay, the real dreams pilot, that was fun. I need to kind of hang up the cleats or the spikes and all that stuff and go full steam ahead. It's been a pilot. But I still want to twist you saying I have that that hunger to competed athletically and I still work out and try to find new new hurdles to jump over, figuratively, literally.

Dave Rogers: 27:08

Opportunity, though, just to just to have the chance to train at those winter sports must've been so cool. One experience. It was terrifying. But it was really

Jared Barkemayer: 27:17

it was no one really tells you there's no like very easy way you just kind of got to go down the track. Essentially. They put you they give you a few tips, but they can't be there with you your first time going, you know what, I was a little lighter than I should have been for bobsled. So they asked me to chop skeleton, which is for those who can't home his face first on the ice. Yep. It's actually one of the safer ones, but then pops that are loose. So, you know, they take you about halfway up the mountain and there's like good luck and you start getting up to speed and they give you some pointers and they just want to see naturally. Like still with your steer with your shoulders. I was like, I don't know what that means. And then the whole way, you're just pinballing across the ice and you're hitting ice at 40 miles to 50 miles per hour on your first runs. And I was black and blue all week. But I it was very fun. And then towards the end of the week, you start really picking it up and but the experience alone just going doing skeleton like class, it was just there's so many things in the airforce like that where you can try these opportunities that are there. So worth its weight. And just doing it

Ben Hall: 28:28

seems like the military over in the US is so much more than like a career or it's just like an all encompassing lifestyle, right where they give you tonnes of opportunities all over the place.

Emily Barkemayer: 28:38

It really is. I mean, there's so many doors open for you when you first start out as you go, and as you age up, and you get older, more experienced and more valuable, you know, some of those doors closed. But overall, there's just so many opportunities.

Ben Hall: 28:54

Point you guys gonna be knocking on the door of desk work.

Emily Barkemayer: 28:59

Oh, well, I'm currently there. But that's because I'm pregnant. So we we already are to be honest, we're, we're senior captains about to be majors, which is the next rank up. And we're definitely getting ageing out of being line pilots and coming into more desk centric leadership roles. Coincidentally, our pilot commitment also ends in 2024. So just a few years from now. So that's when a lot of people make a decision of whether they want to pursue a 20 year or more military career or they love flying more, and they want to jump out and see what other opportunities there are

Dave Rogers: 29:41

20 years sounds a long time, a long time.

Jared Barkemayer: 29:46

And then that's it. That's another one. Emily was alluding to failing at a pod training. When we initially signed up the commitment. It was a 10 year commitment after trains completed. So I was you know, 21 years old at the time, they're like, Hey, this is the next 12 years of your life. And you're like what, like, I'm, I haven't even have cognitive thoughts for 12 years. Yeah. And I have to promise the way the next 12 years like, so that was kind of alarming. However, there's no I mean, I have zero regret saying that I would do it again and again. But at the time, that is a long time. And then as you said another eight years after you've given you know, 12 your best years doing this, and it does take a toll on you and we enjoy it and we're passionate and that's I think why we do relatively well. But it is a long time. Yeah. Yeah.

Ben Hall: 30:33

It's a bit of a young person's game, isn't it? Because you're, I mean, you're all over the place flying. It's elf is pretty physically and sort of emotionally demanding, and how to actually work with your relationship. Can you, like, organise flights at the same time? Or like, how does your roster pattern work? Because I know

Emily Barkemayer: 30:55

in terms of pre kids and post kids, so pre kids dirt, and I would chase each other around the world, we would be on different missions, but we would find each other in different countries. And like he said earlier, we've been deployed together three times. So yeah, we would take trips. And sometimes we'd be like ships passing in the night, or sometimes I'd come home and high five him and he would leave. So it's quite busy. Now with kids thrown in. It's obviously a little more complicated than that. So we have to plan our schedules more, which is provides a lot more predictability to our life, which is is a welcome change. But yeah, it does get it can get difficult. I mean, I don't know if you guys have kids, but single parent ops is not fun for prolonged periods of time. So we make it work. But it's, it's because we have such a solid relationship that we're able to do that.

Dave Rogers: 31:48

Yeah, you're incredibly lucky. And it's important to acknowledge that as well, isn't it the sort of roles that you you have to play to make life good for everybody? But no, Ben and I are childless lads about town. That's not true at all. So Jared, you were talking about that competitive nature, and you find ways to try and be competitive. And right at the top of the podcast, I mentioned, both of your social media followings. And the numbers are quite similar. But there is a differential is that competitive between the two of you?

Jared Barkemayer: 32:26

No, I swear, it's not it really wasn't. To begin with you it she actually delved into it earlier on as more of a recruiting tool, and she's done amazing things in the space, I think, not speak for again, and I'll let her take this. But we both have the social media as a way to let people know about this career field that we kind of, I like to think like backed into, we just didn't know how many amazing opportunities are out there, especially when you're younger. And that's how you kind of reach to the source of that generation. And I'm not doing it on behalf of the Air Force or anything, it's just, I this is an amazing opportunity, I want people to know about how amazing it is. And if you work hard, you can do these things or not. They're not that hard to do, honestly, if you if you put you know, the work and you can do these things. And and that's kind of and then they morphed into like adding more followers and more people asking questions. And, and it's kind of this positive feedback loop. Because you get these stories of people saying, like, hey, how do you become a pilot, and then I, you know, I try to write as many people as I can, like, this is what I recommend in the US. And then, you know, I've done that started that three or four years ago, and I've already got like, those people saying, you know, I just graduated pilot training, I just dropped the seven teens, and you're just like, oh, it really warms your heart and like, gives me goosebumps when you hear those stories. And then mine and Emily has just been an inspiration. Because obviously, in the female aviation, you know, there's not there's, they make like 4% of aviators and most commercial airlines, I think statistics, I'm not, don't quote me on those, but she's recruited so many young women to know that they can do whatever they want to do. And I'm just gonna, like, segue into that, because she's done so many amazing things for us. But she has way more stories about young women like reaching out to her on social media than I do, obviously.

Dave Rogers: 34:10

Yeah. Can you can you give us a bit of an idea that Emily, because Ben and I, as to, for want of a better term, straight white middle class men, we always have the conversation about diversity in aviation, whether it's women, whether it's people of different ethnic backgrounds, and we always kind of ask the question, why isn't there as much diversity is there could be or should be, or we'd like there to be. But ultimately, as I said, we are just two people from the demographic that are over represented in not just aviation, but plenty of other industries. So you're an example of an incredibly successful woman in aviation, who was had a family has a great job is a brilliant pilot. And you're obviously working hard to try and show people that this is a plausible pathway where you can literally have everything. So yeah, just tell us about what you're doing, who you're doing it for, and any kind of stories you've got. I mean, Jared mentioned the people that he's spoken to who've, who've now passed through, are there any examples that that you've had of success on that front as well?

Emily Barkemayer: 35:19

Absolutely. And honestly, it's a privilege to to be able to demonstrate this life that we have because like we said, we're very fortunate and, and we absolutely love what we do. And I just try to do my best to demonstrate our life so that people can see like, hey, they're relatable people like they're totally normal. There's nothing I mean, we have our old, our, you know, our oddities and stuff, but like we're pretty normal people and, and we're doing this and we're having the time of our lives and, and I and diversity is really important to me. Mostly because I have never personally felt like I was treated necessarily differently. Because I was a woman or because I was in the military or because you know what I mean? Like I work with professionals, purely truly professionals, however, you would not believe how many women or young girls reach out to me to be like, Hey, is it really as bad to be a woman in the military as they make it sound or what's it like to be, you know, one of one woman in a sea of 20 dudes, like in a in a squadron or something like that. And it's like, Burgess, Burgess professionals. And I love that I have this platform, to share that from to be like, it's okay to be the only woman in the room. In fact, like it you should want to be because the sooner you're there, the sooner other women will know that they can be there too. And as long as you are strong and competent, there's nothing that's going to stand in your way. At least that's been that's been the situation for me. And so I'm just so grateful that I can share that and that I've had, you know, I can literally say hundreds of women that have reached out to me and asked me questions all the way from, you know, the military to pilot training to upgrade. And I've had the full circle feeling that Jared was talking about to where they were like, I didn't think I could do this. And here I am. I just dropped my dream plane from pilot training. So thank you for inspiring me, which is, which is so like, heartwarming, and just, you know, awesome. Yeah.

Dave Rogers: 37:20

Yeah, absolutely. incredible stuff. Like, it's all well and good. living the life that you live and live in the dream that you've, you've created for yourselves, but the fact that you are creating a pathway and not pulling the ladder up after you, if anything, you're pushing it back down for other people to climb up. That's, that's pretty amazing. In terms of pilot base, then then to sort of bring it back to, to your business, what kind of uptake Are you getting from women at the moment in terms of applications for pilot jobs and things like that.

Ben Hall: 37:54

So it's actually really interesting what Jared and Emily have just been saying, because when I first started pilot base, it was kind of it was to help pilots out. But I've started with a kind of commercial mindset. So I started building the platform. And actually, I started the podcast as a marketing tool effectively. But as I go along, and the more and more people we speak to, and the wider the network grows, the more you realise it's that sort of personal interaction. And, you know, just being able to help people out on a regular basis is a really, really important thing. It's not, you know, spreading stuff far and wide for 50,000 people to see it's, you know, just helping one person every week, just trying to find their way in the aviation world. That's the thing that's been really special. From my point of view. We were mainly European based at the moment we're trying to branch into America. And having guys like you on board is is just fantastic to, you know, have that bedrock of really inspirational pilots where people can look up to you and yeah, and see it's it's a realistic path for anybody really.

Jared Barkemayer: 39:04

Yeah, I agree with what Ben saying, wholeheartedly. We're kind of obviously in a generational shift right now, where we're probably at the tail end, I don't know, you're kind of like stuffing, email white pilots you guys are talking about. And there's just this path, and you can read about it. And there's books and there's always information, but it's not as easily digestible, I would say. And that's kind of where your platform comes in, the more easily digestible, like daily interactions you can have, showing people what you do, and then be authentic about it and not, you know, to be overly like, serious about it. Aviation is a serious, I don't want to make light of that aviation is a serious business with safety measures, and crew resource management, all that thing and all that, obviously. But the easier you can relate to this next generation, who is very more visual learners, they want to see things they don't want to go read them. They want to know the person that is in that job before they have that job to see if they could see themselves doing it, as opposed to just more traditional, you know, university structure or just roll right into that job and study and there is a gap that I think we've started to bridge and that's kind of what we enjoy doing is giving the next generation involved. That's why we do it.

Dave Rogers: 40:19

I think the most important word that you said there was authentic, you've got to be authentic Avenue and and accessed and that's the that's the beauty of it. If you if you post something and it's got a picture and it's got a story people can be like, Oh yeah, I can be like that guy or I can be like that woman and I can I can fly the plane and Do the bob scatter turn or I can be the instructor and the moment. They

Ben Hall: 40:44

say what helps your Instagram channels out there, especially you Jared, your soundtrack is unbelievable. The biggest compliment

Jared Barkemayer: 40:55

about a curator, it's like a modern day sad curator where I really do enjoy the music fitting with the short clips. And like I said, it's easily digestible. It's like 15 seconds to 30 seconds of, wow, this is really cool. And for whatever reason, the music behind it matches so well, but I do spend time trying to find the perfect soundtrack. So thank you, Ben, I really appreciate that.

Dave Rogers: 41:18

So can you share your process your music selection process? Oh my gosh. That's, that's a tough thing to nail down, honestly. But talk you through it 100 times over. And like, over simplifying. Never with headphones in.

Jared Barkemayer: 41:46

Some dinners have been interfered, or I'm like, my brain works in the moment where I have that idea. And I immediately must do it, I can't write it down and say I'll do this later. So like I said, I just try to find the short clips that will capture your eye. And then usually, the music just kind of adds to that. And then the story is always behind it where people can address it. I just tried to keep it quick and authentic. And then if people really do want those deeper conversations, they direct message me and then I am happy to have them. But I try not to do you know, every post is like, you can be a pilot and be inspiration and all these things like every time because in that I think that it goes too far the other way where you almost seem unauthentic when you're trying to be overly authentic, if that makes sense. So I just try to be myself. And then if people want to talk to me, I'll always talk to them and give them as much time as I can obviously not to the detriment of my family or my interactions with my peers, but I will help as much as I can.

Dave Rogers: 42:42

So if people are listening to this podcast, and they want to reach out to either of you, they can get in touch on socials and you'll give them some time.

Ben Hall: 42:50

percent of your handles just for the listeners point of view.

Emily Barkemayer: 42:55

I'm flying with Emily two y's one was taken so I fly with Emily

Jared Barkemayer: 43:02

and then I met he pilots on Instagram as well as Tick Tock. I got into the tick tock world and that's been a whole beast of itself.

Dave Rogers: 43:12

I am I am in the north side of my 30s I'm not going anywhere near Tick Tock

Emily Barkemayer: 43:21

I tease Jared that I think at one time he was probably the oldest. I don't think she's wrong.

Dave Rogers: 43:28

Somebody has to be it's not gonna be it's gonna be someone else. How's the tick tock going? It all seriousness people inside?

Emily Barkemayer: 43:39

Oh, he's blown up. Yeah, we have what do you have 1.7 million followers or something? Yeah. See,

Dave Rogers: 43:46

I only knew about the Instagram. I did. That is my bad research. I didn't know about that. One point. Wow. Yeah. See? That is where good soundtracking comes in Ben.

Jared Barkemayer: 44:03

Oh, yeah. Honestly, that's where that's where I kind of I was pretty you know, just the casual partake in Instagram and Emily had the more of a traditional Instagram pictures and content and then I found Tick Tock when I was studying. I was actually in one of our captain's career courses like a polishing school Air Force officers, if you will. We're no flying is involved. So naturally, I was bored, but still trying to pay attention. But that's when I found Tick Tock when I had some more time on my hands. And I posted a video not thinking anything. It just had a cool sound to it. And I was flying in Hawaii, which obviously lends itself to some good views. And that video blew up and I just kind of kept doing it. And then I was like, Oh, why social Instagram kind of copied tik tok in a way with their Instagram reels. And so I started posting reels and the same the same kind of outline with a short video and a good soundtrack that I could find and that's why my Instagram started progressing as I got a lot of followers from tik tok coming over. Is

Ben Hall: 45:09

that when you over took Emily Yep.

Dave Rogers: 45:13

Just turn the grenade in there, Ben. Yeah, and also well, and you're just like, Oh, there goes the pin. Unreal,

Emily Barkemayer: 45:21

he earned it. I mean, he posts nearly every day, which is what you have to do and he's doing a great job.

Dave Rogers: 45:27

I'm on like, a post every seven months at the moment. It's fine. It's fine. Right then guys, this has been an absolute joy. A couple of quick ones to finish them. Any planes you haven't flown that you'd love to fly?

Emily Barkemayer: 45:45

I've always wanted to fly so I'm 47 maybe I still can. We'll see.

Dave Rogers: 45:50

What is it about the 747 that you like?

Emily Barkemayer: 45:54

I I just like how big it is. Honestly, it's so pretty. It's so Amish She's the queen. I want to fly the queen,

Ben Hall: 46:01

right? Yeah. And she's getting it she's going extinct. So my time is limited.

Dave Rogers: 46:10

Jared,

Jared Barkemayer: 46:11

I'm much more like newschool so like the newest stuff on the block. 787 Dreamliner seems awesome. We I think we were passengers on one. And I mean, the air even smells nicer. So I was just like, man, that'd be pretty nice to fly. So anything that's the newest? I'm kind of those guys. You know, this phone guy. I know. Some of those people are the worst, but I like the new stuff.

Dave Rogers: 46:31

Something smells like rich people.

Ben Hall: 46:35

Not gonna get Americans like near bosses. Oh, we

Jared Barkemayer: 46:39

were I'm coming around. Honestly, I didn't. I was the stubborn, you know, Boeing products, but we fly an Airbus 320. I've been on a couple times with Alaska Airlines zones. And I was impressed. Honestly.

Dave Rogers: 46:53

I love the 320. Last time I was on a 320 I had a nap woke up and forgot I was on a plane. Yeah, what a joy. What a joy. Any countries that you haven't had the chance to fly to yet that you'd love to visit.

Emily Barkemayer: 47:08

I have not had the opportunity to hit New Zealand or Australia yet, which is rare for being stationed out here. Blaming the COVID. So soon as I'm back from maternity leave, I'm hopping on the first trip down here I can see Jared.

Jared Barkemayer: 47:25

The same actually i want to i would like to go to New Zealand and Australia. And c 17 actually does go to Antarctica, we need to do some. There's one unit and in Washington state that goes to Antarctica. And that's kind of a bit of bucket lists. That's how it usually most of us get the seven continents as you should do that mission and land out in the ice down there. It's in the cards but good. You got skis on for that. Now we don't we just have the C 130s. Do the skis. I think it's the New York unit and your garden unit. But now the C 17 has the braking capabilities in there Phil does have to have to be in the right conditions the right weather a little more so than the 130s. But yeah, it lashes out of Christchurch in New Zealand. So it's a good good deal to be down there operating.

Dave Rogers: 48:13

I was about to wrap the podcast up but we need to put more meat on this bone. skis

Emily Barkemayer: 48:22

would like to see a C 17 on ski. Now they just put skis on the on the 130

Jared Barkemayer: 48:29

there's still wheels like on them. It's just kind of think of about think about I've seen a water plane that lands on the water. So very similar the buoys, they're shaped the same way. They're just skis to spread the dispersion on the runway, but there's still tires on there.

Dave Rogers: 48:48

But how? How does it stop?

Jared Barkemayer: 48:52

Well, that's still the braking on the tire. Okay. that'll cause the stopping on until a shout out the bottom of the skis

Dave Rogers: 48:59

told you that he said he questions told you guys, this has been such a joyous conversation. It's been so nice to get to know you. And I really hope that some listeners do reach out because it sounds like you've got some wonderful things to say and examples to give. And hopefully, you continue to have a great life together with your family as aviators and helping more people get into into the industry to lead that great life as well. Thank you so much.

Emily Barkemayer: 49:30

Thanks for joining us. Truly. Thank you.

Jared Barkemayer: 49:33

Thank you guys, obviously, for having us and reaching out and I mean, we're honoured obviously, Ben, we love what you're doing. Dave, it was great to meet you. You're such a pleasure. Honestly, if you ever want us back down the road, just shoot us a message. We'd be happy to continue this and hopefully, this helps you guys get reach out to more people as well. Many say